The Town of Mooresville’s personnel policy allows for an employee to file a grievance within 14 calendar days of disciplinary action.
The Mooresville Tribune reported today that the town’s former police chief, John Crone, has filed a grievance with the Town of Mooresville over his firing on Aug. 7. (http://mooresvilletribune.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=MOT/MGArticle/MOT_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1173356123573)
Though some readers have expressed concerns since the news was posted earlier today – with many of them wondering why Crone apparently received 50 calendar days to file his grievance – the question that must first be answered is this: when did Crone first file the grievance?
Citing personnel statutes, Town Attorney Steve Gambill declined to say today, explaining: “My inclination is that such information is part of the grievance itself and by implication, part of the personnel file.
“I am trying to avoid the proverbial ‘splitting of hairs,’” Gambill added, “but I don’t know of any other way to interpret the personnel law statute (GS 160A-168) other than to lean this way.”
But what we do know is this: For the town to accept the grievance in accordance with its own personnel policy, Crone would have had to file his grievance with Assistant Town Manager Erskine Smith (who was interim town manager until Sept. 2) by Aug. 21.
Smith had 14 days to respond to the grievance. And apparently Crone was not satisfied with Smith’s response, so he appealed to Mooresville’s new town manager, Steve Husemann.
Gambill explains:
“Article X, Section 4 of the Personnel Policy sets out three steps in the grievance process:
“In Step 1,” Gambill said, “an employee has 14 days from the time of the employment action to file the grievance. The employee’s supervisor then has 14 days to respond after receiving the grievance.
“In Step 2,” Gambill continued, “if the grievance is not resolved to the employee’s satisfaction in Step 1, the employee may appeal to the next level supervisor within 14 days after receiving the response in Step 1. This supervisor then has 14 days to respond."
Finally, Gambill said, “In Step 3, if the grievance is not resolved to the satisfaction of the employee at the end of Step 2, the employee may appeal in writing within 14 days to the Town Manager or Assistant Town Manager, according to whom they report to.”
Gambill went on to put those steps into perspective concerning Crone: “He had 14 days after his termination to file a grievance to Mr. Smith who issued the termination. Mr. Smith then had 14 days after receiving it to respond.
“Mr. Crone then had 14 days after receipt of Mr. Smith’s response to appeal to the Town Manager,” Gambill said, adding, “The Town Manager then has 14 days to respond to Mr. Crone."
While Gambill did not say when Crone’s original grievance was filed, he did say that employees must “follow the steps outlined in the policy” and that “one step is completed before the next step is initiated.”
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Jamie, thanks for getting this info out there. Did Mr. Gambill discuss the fact that in Step 4 the appeal would go, in this case, to the Assistant Town Manager since the Police Chief reports directly to the Town Manager?
So in this case, Smith fired Crone. And, assuming that Crone has followed the policies, he has filed written appeals along the way. So at the end of it, if he continues to appeal he'll go right back to where he started -- Smith.
But Larry, let us not forget that Erskine Smith is the Golden Child, He-Who-Must-Be-Protected-At-All-Cost, and handled with kit gloves. Sooooo, we will take even this off his already-empty plate and place it on Husemann's plate, allowing Erskine to retreat to the comfort and safety to which he is entitled to as well as accustomed to. Never mind that Smith is making almost as much as Husemann. That is just the way it is. Smith has no culpability, no responsibility, while Husemann will have all of it. And so it has been decreed.
Actually in this case it should be Husemann that has the final decision. The policy is designed so that if a Department that reports to the Town Manager has a grievance the Asst. TM rules thus preventing a conflict of interest. In this case, since Smith WAS the manager at the time and took the action being greived, the Husemann should hear it because he would not have been part of the action. On a side note, most greivance policies require that the person filing the grievance include a request for the remedy sought. It would be intersting to know what Crone asked for. I do not think he has any illusion of getting his job back. In my opinion he wants the termination lifted and the resignation accepted so he can stand a better chance of getting hired by some other gullible town. In my opinion, assuming that he has followed the intent of the standards in the way he filed the grievance, it should be upheld and the termination stand.
Yep 4:36--good points. You also have to remember that it wasn't a resignation, it was retirement, so the chief probably like you said wants the termination lifted so that he can retire. If they let him retire, not only will he maybe find work in another gullible town but he'd also get a lot of retirement benefits.
What I'd like to konw is who has this idiot hired to represent him? It's likely he'll have some jail time or probation at the least. He broke the law. He shouldn't get a break especially after what he put others through.
Hey Crone,
"You don't work here anymore, so we don't have any obligation to you".
If you think long and hard, you will remember those are YOUR words exactly that you said to a former employee of yours (that you rail-roaded out the door).
What goes around, comes around.
4:36 -- that would require the town to utilize "common sense" in application of this policy. However, the way the policy is worded says that Crone's grievance should be heard by the Town Manager -- which Smith was not if we are to accept as truth what we've been told about Smith's title and job during the interim. So if the Town follows their policy, then Smith is the proper person to hear this grievance. If the Town differs from the policy as it's written, then there is a clear basis by which Crone could sue the town.
As to his retirement, I believe his retirement is vested with the State, so I'm not sure his termination will impact his access to those funds.
My point in my original post was that the ToM is in quite a predicament as it pertains to the wording and implementation of the grievance procedures. Apply common sense -- get sued for misapplying the policy. Apply the policy as written -- Smith gets to hear the grievance and, possibly, overturn his initial decision. This stuff gets more interesting each day.
larry, I do not disagree, however, since only the Town Manger has the authority to hire and fire a department head I do not buy the notion that Smith was not acting in the role of town manager. Either way there is no way that Smith can overturn his own secision to terminate and not look like the idiot he is. It would be like saying Hey I fired you but I did so wrongly...I cannot see Smith admitting that he is the fool we all think he is. Any you are correct about the retirement system. As I posted in the other thread it is a State System and the Tom has nothing to do with those benefits. However, I do believe that his termination does relieve the town from paying the retirement supplement pay that he would normally receive if he had retired from the State system in good standing.
One thing is for certain. Smith and others consulted the town attorney before Crone's termination. Surely they covered their ass. I would think the town attorney even consulted others before rendering his verdict.
With this in mind, Crone's termination was legit and he is only trying to save face.
The supplement is only good till his 62nd birthday. He should be near that now. He gets the supplement each month till 62 and he gets the month that it falls in then no more
There are several developments that may be of interest, but unknown:
.
1. If Crone filed his grievance within the required 14 days (August 21 ) , why did we not Know of this action until September 23/25 ?
2. Since the Town policy requires a response to a grievance, submitted at the First Step, to be within 14 days of its receipt, this response should have been received by Crone at the soonest – August 23, or at the latest – September 4.
3. Did Crone receive a First Step answer? If so, what was it? If the answer was received, and he was not satisfied, he is entitled to proceed to the Second Step within 14 days of its receipt. In such a case, the latest he may submit his appeal would be September 18, if maximum time limits were utilized.
4. Did Crone proceed to the Second Step within 14 days of his receipt of the First Step answer?
5. What are the policy provisions if the First Step (or other Step) answers are not received by the Grievant by the 14th day? Does the person submitting the Grievance WIN by default?
6. North Carolina is an Employment at Will State. This means continued employment of an employee can be terminated by either the Employer or the Employee.
7. In the absence of a contract of employment, an Employee may be fired by his/her Employer. Such discharge may be for a variety of reasons. It may be for NO reason. However, it may not be for a BAD reason.
8. In Crones case, to be successful in his pursuit of overturning his discharge, it must be proven he was fired for a BAD reason.
9. Since the situation regarding the removal of Crone from his employment with the Town of Mooresville seems to be either for dishonesty or failure to perform, a great deal of thought, and care, must be taken if the Grievance Procedure is being followed.—For instance: it would be a ridiculous turn - of – events if the adjudicators regarding the Grievance decided to reinstate Crone, only to have, at a later date, the Judicial system rule he violated the Law.
10. Since Grievance Procedures, by their very nature, are designed to expedite decisions, and our legal processes are uniformly slow, Steve Gambill needs to council the Town Administration against finalizing the Grievance, until the investigation and legal questions have been concluded.
Finally, it is not unusual for a Grievance Procedure to permit extensions to time limits, if such are agreed to in, writing, by both Parties. This may be an appropriate way to slow the system down at any Step.
By the way, in case the thought crosses anyone’s mind, offering Crone the opportunity to resign, will open the door for him to file a complaint of Constructive Discharge.
Harold Salisbury
Is it possible that these are all antics designed to allow Crone to stay in town and be hired by, let's say, any one of the people who signed that famous letter of support for him? As it stands, I imagine none of them can hire him without fear of losing business. Let's face it. Can you imagine frequenting any business right now that employs him? But I can easily see them telling John Crone that if he is successful at somehow polishing up his image through some misleading P.R. sprinkled with a little fake outrage, then perhaps just perhaps he can stick around town and they would hire him. Just a theory! After all, it is anybody's guess as to who is in his little "book of secrets" he has allegedly bragged about.
Who cares?
WE care.
Talk about wasting taxpayer money! Seems that we've blown a ton of money as a result of Crone's crap. And now we're going to spend some more.
Harold, you may have questions, but you are not entitled to the answers. It is a personnel issue and therefore protected. Sorry, have a nice day. Enjoy your Matlock
Harold, thanks for the deep thoughts and insight.
9:36, Your smugness is irritating. Get in the shots you can before the charges are made. Illegal activity has a way of turning "personel matters" into public information.
Crone's angling for a job locally. Anybody can see that. Let's see who the fool is who's actually gonna give him a job here in town before he gets carted off to a federal prison and leaves egg on their face too!
Bottom line is that the law clearly provides that the town manager can make an entire personnel file and matter public if it is necessary to do so in order to attempt to restore public confidence. Husemann needs to open the entire thing up to public scrutiny at this point. We have no reason to believe any of the representations being made by the town or Crone without documentation. Is Husemann going to continue this town's history of hiding behind "personnel" in matters where the town has lost the entire confidence of the public.
I don't know if I would call it "hiding", but Mr. Husemann did respond to an e-mail I sent and indicated that the could not comment on personnel issues.
The only people interested in hiding things under presonnel are Rader, Smith and our do-nothing albatross of an attorney, Steve Gambill, Esq.
It will become public knowledge despite their best attempts to cover up.
Hey Husemann, why haven't you fired Jackie Moore? She is about to be the cause of another discrimination lawsuit being filed againest Mooresville.
Let me spell that out to you Husemann, I have already spoken to the EEOC about Jackie Moore. I have a case for discrimination on several accounts because of a limited disability and her refusal to hire me. Whatcha gonna do before it hits the fan???
I dare you to act on your own without the guidance of Yoda.
J-me, almost 155,000 hits my girl!! You rock darlin'. Keep up the good work. I hope they shudder every time you walk by.
Dear 9:59, you are correct. Criminal charges will be made public. It does not change the fact that personnel issues are not public. Call it smug if you want, but it is what it is, despite what Harold and Kay believe they are entitled to.
Do Harold and Kay actually live in Mooresville, or is it Statesville?
Where's Tic Toc, AKA Island or Time Traveler? I have not seen any legal opinions or articles posted in full. Maybe he is in church? Or not........
Time Traveler is right here bitch. Have no idea where the other two are you have mentioned.
Why don't you morons get on another blog to sling crap at one another. This is a respectable blog, and it's intent by Jaime, was to put out the latest on whatever the TOM is up to. Get the hell out of this blog, you clutter up our respecfull folks who want to comment in a civil manner.
Yeah Time Traveler, you're outta here
Dear 10:07, please tell me who I am supposed to be respectful of? My fellow human being, or do I need to be lavishing praise on your deity, Jaime? If it's the latter, then I'm sorry. I appreciate the news, but she is not my God. If it's the former, then I'm afraid that 95% of the posts on this blog are disrespectful of one person or another. In case you missed it, read the comments again. They are all disrespectful of someone. Someone is always showing disrespect for Jaime, Larry, Atkins, Tic Toc, Time Traveler, Bob Bob, Crone, Rader, Smith, Harold, Kay, etc. If you lay out accusations, please do as Tic Toc suggests and lay out the accusations equally and broadly.
10:07 is correct in saying that the purpose of this BLOG is to address corruption, not for slinging crap. I made this post myself, a long time ago...
"Well, as usual this post is heading downhill rapidly.
There are those who dissagree in discussion and those who attack without sense or accountability. Their only goal is to disrupt the direction of the discussion.
When a jackass brays, the only answer they need is chiiiirp chiiiiirp!"
Guess I got tired of chirping and ignoring. There is at least one person on here who is on here solely for the purpose of antagonizing and disrupting the BLOG.
This person (or people) never have a valid point or a constructive argument, just little smartass childish remarks.
I have limited my response to this (these) persons, but at times feel the need to vent by addressing their ignorance.
Whoever this person, people are, they are obviously convinced they are going down and are trying to get in whatever stabs they can before the hammer drops.
The investigation has uncovered some major problems that have been well known but not public for years. This apparently has struck the nerves of those who are a part of the misdoing.
Time Traveler
My worry is not so much Crone anymore (because he's a goner), but the ones still there, the Thunberg, Rader, Smith types. Now throw Maia Setzer and Gambell in there and you've got some serious trust issues going on. This is a big mess, much bigger than Crone.
I said in a previous post and still stand by it that this is going to extend past Crone and into the county. There will be those around Crone in local government and those around Redmond who will get swept up with the tide of investigation.
The roots of corruption run deep. None of this could have been possible without those roots. There are too many checks and balances in place for indescrepicies not to be noticed and talked about. There are others involved directly and those who are involved by inactivity and the decision to do nothing.
Crone has been knocked off his high horse and there will be others to follow. His ego won't allow him to take his lumps and go on.
The success of this investigation that resulted from a few taking a stand will encourage others to do the same, which will result in further uncovering of more corruption.
Time Traveler
Here's a sobering thought. If it weren't for all the squeaky wheels of Mooresville we'd all still have the crooked John Crone as our chief of police, we'd be none the wiser, puttering along without a clue, and he'd still be making his deals with the devils in town, all of them just getting fatter and fatter in treasure or power, all off our backs. My question is this: Who else is still left doing this kind of dirty business right under our nose? You can take this to the bank - there days are numbered too. They can do waht Crone ought to have done. Felt the heat going up and left on his own. Or they can do what he actually did. Dug his heels in and wouldn't budge. It's all about free will man.
have any of you creeps considered running for public office yourself? it would be far more productive than wasting your time on a blog whose publisher has a few skeletons of her own. funny how the good old boys are being replaced by the good new boys. will these sheeple even be around ten or twenty years from now? the bottomline is if you dont like mooresville, move. but dont try to change us. we were fine before the investigative reporters came to town, and we will be fine once they leave. and whats with a preacher that spends more than half his congregations time surfing the net? maybe we need to put reverend gren under the microscope. afterall, didnt jesus hang out with sinners?
Time Traveler, it does not stop with the town or county. It extends to the state and country. Your neighbors are involved, as are your entire congregation. Go to the grocery store. They're all involved. Matter of fact, you'd be hard pressed to find anyone not involved. Lowes, well they're involved too. Anyone working for them, doing business with them or buying from them. Same with Home Depot. All the lawyers, doctors, cashiers, retirees, and barbers.
We're all part of it. Guess you got left out and it rubs you the wrong way.
what kind of jerk assumes that an annonymous post is time traveler? i guess the same kind that posts annonomously! ha!
anywho, i am NOT time traveler. but i do wish i could find a contraption that would catapult me far enough back to build a huge fence to keep all you "come heres" out.
bet you are just gulliable enough to respond. what a joke!
Dear 3:32, I was directing my comment to Time Traveler from his comment at 11:42 where he signed his name Time Traveler.
Not sure who you are or when you posted prior to 3:32 and don't really care. Have a nice day.
my bad. whoops!maybe its not all about me.
Hey ya'll. Looks like the Pathetic Poster's talking to himself again.
September 28, 2008 1:34 PM wrote:
"Here's a sobering thought. If it weren't for all the squeaky wheels of Mooresville we'd all still have the crooked John Crone as our chief of police, we'd be none the wiser, puttering along without a clue, and he'd still be making his deals with the devils in town, all of them just getting fatter and fatter in treasure or power, all off our backs. My question is this: Who else is still left doing this kind of dirty business right under our nose? You can take this to the bank - there days are numbered too. They can do waht Crone ought to have done. Felt the heat going up and left on his own. Or they can do what he actually did. Dug his heels in and wouldn't budge. It's all about free will man."
That about sums it up...
Dear 5:23, how would you know? We all sign as anonymous. ......
3:28 pm's nonsensical rhetoric is better described as false ideology. This is the brand of "loyalty" that corruption can purchase with the help of resources paid for by the unwitting taxpayer.
Dear 6:21, I'm afraid that you are making more of this than what it is. It was plain ole sarcasm on my part. Sorry to disappoint.
6:31
I was going to post earlier and will now that this has been brought up again.
Although your 3:28 post was composed of smartass sarcasm, it accidently hit on a truth. Everyone is involved. Not as part of a conspiracy, but by way of apathy.
Look at the small number of posters on here and subtract from that the people like you that are only here to heckle and agitate.
That leaves only a few who actually care about the issue of corruption and wrongdoing in our government.
Someone said earlier that this BLOG has had over 150,000 hits. That is alot of hits for so few involved persons.
So you were right. The people at my church, my neighbors, people at the grocery store and Lowes, they're all in on it. Most people are hiding and looking out for number one.
Part of the reason is because there are alot of people out there like you waiting to harass anyone who tries to make something right.
I commend those who are trying to make a difference and I do look forward to this extending into the corruption that I know exists in the County.
Time Traveler
I do believe 3:28 just got TOLD!
"Dear 3:28" please go blow smoke up somebody else's behind. Thank you very much and you have a nice day, too.
Dear 8:09, you are an emotional child. You probably have school in the morning, so go to bed.
As for Time Traveler, I know nothing of County Government, so I can't argue with you. You could be right. As for Mooresville, you have dragged many through the mud and some that I know are not guilty of anything. But that does not matter to you. You fail to realize what you do and the results. God is watching and knows when there is justice and when there is injustice. HE has the final verdict.
And how, excatly to you know this figure? Oh wait, you don't.
and whats with a preacher that spends more than half his congregations time surfing the net?
maybe we need to put reverend gren under the microscope. Somehow I don't think Green has a problem with this. I believe he has extended an invitation to anyone to meet with him at any time.
afterall, didnt jesus hang out with sinners? Hence, your need to set up an appointment to meet with him. I'm sure he'd be happy to hang out with you just as he hangs out with lots of people throughout the week. I've actually seen him pull over on the ramp at Exit 33 and have a conversation with the guy who usually stands there and collects change.
Seems to me that you spend far more time on here than you care to admit and are simply trying to sling mud to detract from the conversation.
Crone is going down and he's going to take the RATS with him. He will not go gently into the night because his ego won't let him. So go and console him and remind him that accountability for one's actions is key to the redeption process.
9:37...Thank you. A voice of reason is nice.
A voice of reason would be nice. Be sure to let us know when it happens. I'm still waiting.
OK, voice of reason ... 9:37
I love how you idiots use the "hit counter" as some kind of trophy. You do realize that every time you refresh the page it counts as another hit dont you? For example, Tic Toc is probably on here on average 8 hours a day and I bet he refreshes the page looking for new post 500 times. So 500 times 7 days a week equals 3500 hits. Wow doesnt seem to accurate now does it? I guess I shouldnt be suprised though, none of you have ever cared about the WHOLE story, just whatever you want to hear and believe.
well then, thank you for posting so often so we have something to refresh and read
I bet you refreshed the page 6 times waiting on this response. 6 more hits for the blog!!!!!! We are showing them.
Nope, sure didn't. The system refreshes automatically at some point following new posts.
In response to 10:55...
What we've got here is failure to communicate. Some men you just can't reach...
Time Traveler
Our Tax Dollars at work...
Steven Husemann Town of Mooresville Town Manager $125,000.00
Stephen P. Gambill Town of Mooresville Town Attorney $112,891.45
N. Erskine Smith Town of Mooresville Assistant Town Manager $106,508.78
John Vest Town of Mooresville Director of Public Services $97,684.00
Maia M. Setzer Town of Mooresville Director of Adm. And Finance $97,683.53
Wesley H. Greene Town of Mooresville Fire Chief $95,928.73
Timothy D. Brown Town of Mooresville Planning Director $91,842.05
Wanda McKenzie Town of Mooresville Parks and Recreation Director $89,602.43
Charles B. Roberts Town of Mooresville Golf Course Director $88,496.45
Jackie L. Moore Town of Mooresville Human Resources Director $85,285.13
Jeff Brotherton Town of Mooresville Information Tech. Manager $84,231.43
Ryan Rase Town of Mooresville Engineering Manager $83,204.00
John Pritchard Town of Mooresville Library Director $77,263.48
Deborah Hockett Town of Mooresville Senior Accountant $76,310.23
Carl Robbins Town of Mooresville Police Major (Interim Chief) $76,170.00
John Finan Town of Mooresville Public Works Manager $74,967.00
Michael Lamberth Town of Mooresville Wastewater Treatment Plant Suptd. $74,309.43
Pressley K. Hillard Town of Mooresville Police Major $72,477.75
Dereck Harwell Town of Mooresville Water Treatment Plant Superintendent $69,834.28
Michael Barnhardt Town of Mooresville Bldg & Grounds Technical Support $69,133.00
James C. Deaton Town of Mooresville Asst. Fire Chief/Operations $68,965.08
Gary Styers Town of Mooresville Fire Marshal $68,297.80
Leonard McLaughlin Town of Mooresville Sanitation Superintendent $64,934.78
Craig A. Culberson Town of Mooresville Sr. Planner $64,196.78
Richard B. Anderson Town of Mooresville Police Captain $64,184.48
Yep, only in Mooresville would a golf course director make $12K more a year than an acting chief of police.
How much does Jaime make? Is she employed?
MS. Gatton is not a public employee and therefore she is not paid with tax dollars and her salary is not public record. Instead of worrying about her salary and if she is employeed you should be worried about how your town tax dollars are being spent.
The salaries of just those individuals listed is in excess of 2 million. This is only the top wage earners and not the entire annual city payroll. It also does not include benefits.
11:17 and 11:21, good points. I guess the real question is how do those salaries compare with other towns and cities? They seem inline to me, but I certainly have not done a great deal of comparisons. Sounds like a great task for Jaime.
Wow! Even if these salaries are in line with other municipalities, are we getting our money's worth? Our new manager is still to be determined but with Smith, Moore, & Greene we are getting a royal screw job. Those 3 have got to be beyond other cities/towns our size. What a rip off! Moore doesn't even do her job and Greene refuses to drive a new vehicle issued to him. Hey Wes, if you don't want it, let's save tax money and give it back. He was getting the ax from Mt. Airy for spousal abuse and romancing other women and it looks like we've inherited someone else's problem. Moore was fired from Lincoln County and we pick up her baggage.
Gary Styers was hired without all certifications for his job. He was hired because of an arson sniffing dog that Greene took credit for. The dog retires in January so what about Styers? Does he meet the job desciption or is he following in Greene's footsteps and screwing us?
How many of these high salaries live in the town limits or take city ownwd vehicles home?
9:28, 3:09
all right Frank Owens, this is your last warning to shut up and don't even think of running for so much as dog catcher anymore boy.
9-29-08 11 a.m.:
so..what do YOU do for a living?
and to the rest of those who can't quit diggin on charlie roberts- leave the guy alone,he's recovering from some serious surgery. be decent for a day in your life.
Hey jamie,
have you confirmed when Crone filed that greivance? was it actually within the 14 day requirement?
and Larry the preacher-
what gives on the FOIA request you submitted for Rader's email list??does he actually have 1800 subscribers? How did he come to compile that list??did he have access to the mi-connection subscriber list while he was on the advisory board and is he still on that board?how did someone who supposedly has no access to that information come across 1800 names?? it couldn't be the investigattons or the sewing circle!our numbers are supposedly inconsequential.his church doesn't have that many members, neither does the civitans. it makes one scratch one's head and wonder??can you possibly zero in on that question for us??thanks.
Hello o o o o o- anybody here?
what kind of dumbass chooses the name time traveller??? what are you a trekkie or something, do you have a grip on reality or is your reality monopolizing this blog like the other nuts tic toc, bob bob, ray ray etc.don't forget the senior guy who thinks he's an lawyer. go away. haven't you noticed everybody else has left the building and checks in periodically to see if the coast is clear from the deluded.
what kind of dumbass chooses the name time traveller??? what are you a trekkie or something, do you have a grip on reality or is your reality monopolizing this blog like the other nuts tic toc, bob bob, ray ray etc.don't forget the senior guy who thinks he's an lawyer. go away. haven't you noticed everybody else has left the building and checks in periodically to see if the coast is clear from the deluded.
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