The Town of Mooresville continues working with the State Bureau of Investigation to complete several probes into former Mooresville Police Chief John Crone and his Cops for Kids program.
The SBI is conducting a criminal investigation, and the town is in the middle of its own internal personnel investigation, which is assessing the conduct of town employees – including Crone – related to Cops for Kids. The N.C. Secretary of State’s office is investigating Cops for Kids’ charitable solicitation license but has not been available for an update this week. Additionally, the town is conducting an audit of Cops for Kids and an inventory of the police department evidence room.
Town investigation
Ken Andrews, the former FBI agent who is heading up the town’s investigation, has completed his first round of interviews. Additional interviews depend on the schedule of the SBI’s investigation, which is not known. Andrews, however, is apparently currently working on a preliminary draft of his findings.
Evidence room inventory
Three town employees – Acting Police Chief Carl Robbins, Accountant Deborah Hockett and Finance Director Maia Setzer – have completed an initial inventory of the police department’s evidence room, at the direction of the SBI. The initial review took almost 50 hours for the three employees to complete and resulted in Crone's ultimate termination from the Town of Mooresville (see http://thegattonreport.blogspot.com/2008/08/evidence-room-inventory-led-to-crones.html). For unknown reasons, the SBI has directed the three employees to conduct a second review. The timeframe for that – and for those three town employees to write detailed reports of their findings and submit them to the SBI – is unclear.
Audits
The town hired Tom Himes with Carolina Financial Investigations – who has former experience with the Internal Revenue Service – to conduct an audit of the Cops for Kids financial records. A second firm, which will verify Himes' findings, could be hired as soon as the Sept. 2 town board meeting.
After reviewing seven years of Cops for Kids' financial documents, Carolina Financial Investigations will turn over results of its probe to the town possibly within the next three weeks. The second firm could have its results to the town as soon as a month later.
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
Posts
122 comments:
Great job Jamie! It's a shame we no longer have a newspaper here in Mooresville willing to keep an eye on our local government. Since Bill Thunburg became mayor, Dale Gowing seems more interested in protecting Thunburg and the other crooks in our government rather than doing any real investigative reporting.
It is interesting to note the unbelievable amount of money the SPENDERS will pay for outside companies to audit situations created by incompetence.
It would be less costly if they took the time to establish and maintain Systems' Control, which, if done without Rader's interference, would protect the Assets and well-being of the Town!
Harold Salisbury :)
OK...having gotten back on my feet after receiving my property tax bill tonight (thanks to the "Tax and Spend Gang") I can't help but wonder.....how much is this all costing?
I mean....we have investigations in to the investigations of the investigations....and the meter is running on all of them. What is the cost so far...and if financial impropriety is found can we recover damages?
Harold for president! He seems to know everything. How is Mooresville operating w/o he and his wife?
Great question Jim.
I agree 8:18. Harold for President, and as you can see, we aren't doing too well without him here. You must be one of the crooks whose trail he was hot on. We're tired of you dissing the Salisburies. Let me guess. You're somebody with the golf course that he was investigating, and found FREE OF CHARGE (no investigator fees needed there!) that somebody was stealing thousands of dollars worth of inventory right out of there, probably giving to their buddies who then protected them from getting fired. We've got your number.
Harold, you keep on keeping on.
If impropriety is found, whoever is responsible should pay restitution to the town for all the investigations.
If we had more people like Harold and a few others I've gome to know this town would be a LOT better off. Cheering for the crooks and freeloaders on OUR payroll whom we cannot control due to "personnel issues"must mean you are one of the problems that need to be "resolved".
Hallelujah to that! I'm sick to death of the "free loaders" pointing their dirty little fingers at the local activists/heroes who actually have the brains, guts and whatever else it takes to let the rest of us know when we're being ripped off.
The scapegoat will be Crone. Mr. Crone,I hope that when they hang you out to dry, you will strike a deal to testify against the rest. The irony of all this is that the crooks gets to choose the investigators who are looking at the crooks. Everyone I have talked to laughs, because think about it, it's like The Mafia telling the FBI and U.S. Dept. of Justice, "we have an investigator and one of our accountants will look at the books, and we will tell you what we find, if we find anything." The root found at the MPD leads back to Town Hall, so we need to cut the root to prevent losing the whole tree! That is the prevelant logic from our local government, and they wonder why "the March" happened. Just remember today's Tribune regarding the head of the Christian Mission, and he wasn't even in law enforcement-Please offer Mr. Crone a deal to testify, because the ToM needs to have someone fat singing.
August 22, 2008 8:18 PM says sarcastically: "Harold for president! He seems to know everything. How is Mooresville operating w/o he and his wife?" I would say "not too good". We have a police chief who could very well be facing criminal charges and possibly jail time due to misdeeds over the span of a decade. We have an Assistant Town Manager who either was aware of these misdeeds by the former police chief and did nothing about them, or worse, he was none the wiser as the misdeeds occurred right under his nose. We have a mayor who is Missing In Action during one of the worst crises this town has ever faced. We have at least one errant town councilman by the name of Frank Rader, who is being accused of witness tampering and obstruction of justice during the course of the criminal investigations into the former police chief. We have the rest of the town board willing to tolerate being lied to and deceived by the Interim Town Manager. Need I go on? I, for one, would love nothing more than for Mr. and Mrs. Salisbury to return to Mooresville and start sweeping again...
What?!!! The investigations "continue"??? YEEEPEEEEEE. That's more than has ever happened before! Usually by now everybody involved would have gotten a raise, a promotion and some sort of AWARD! Beggars can't be choosers, so I'm ecstatic that there are even still investigations going on! Call me jaded.
Hopefully these investigations will be real ones and not ones used to cover up the real issues like the library "investigation". But as long as Erskin is involved I'm not holding my breath.
Erskine? Erskine who? He is officially a Politically Dead Man Walking as is anybody who hitches their cart to his particular horse.
all I wanna know is who's in "Time Out" with Rader? I wanna shake their hand.
Yeah, I read that silly man's blubbering the other day. Somebody please let Frank Rader know it's him who just got spanked by the Gatton Report. Rader putting somebody in "Time Out" is like a preschooler putting his teacher in "Time Out". Talk about ass backwards. What a pathetic joke this man has become. Some commissioner. Great for our image.
Did he announce his "forum" at the library on the 27th? I'm not on his mailing list anymore :-)
Mr. Green, I have cut and pasted below the portion of Mr. Rader's e-publication which I believe you are referring to.
============
On Wednesday, August 27 at the ToM Library at 7 - 9 pm I will have a "ToM Discourse",
The discourse is of idea and opinion. The new event is born of statements and questions posed by a folk(s) who think I've done wrong. Over time I hope
it becomes a reasoned way to examine and discuss as much ToM information as legally and practically possible.
Among the queries, this:
"Commissioner Rader took it upon himself to penetrate the sanctity of the
police department and inject himself into this personnel/criminal
investigation by overtly trying to influence the rank and file police
officers."
and among the questions, this:
". . . would you find it appropriate for an elected official to attend and
make presentations at several recent staff meetings of the police department
and apparently share with officers the anonymous letter that was sent to
Crone?"
Among anticipated questions this: (Rader wording) Why did you speak with ToM
Police about the Cops for Kids investigation and what did you say?
This is part of speculation (my term) spoken, written and demonstrated by
anonymous, though some public, voices. (Note: I do not read Web Logs =
Blogs.)
The questioners prefer email questions and I prefer face to face, thus the
evening, which, if well attended, will become monthly or quarterly.
I cannot assure the questioners will attend, though the prime reason for the
session is to address their questions and ask them mine. An invitation to a
specific questioner to attend a ToM Chat has been turned down by the
questioner, him or her insisting on email correspondence.
I'll come with a prepared discussion of the ToM Budget (yawn) and lead with
that, then field what question may come, subject to NC Statute restrictions
(personnel and closed session).
Note: One of the potential questioners is in Time Out for using language not
acceptable in Kindergarten and will not be entertained. To the extent the
questioner insists on questioning, it will just consume time.
The ground rules are:
Questioners/Investigattons identify themselves by name and town.
Questions are limited to one minute.
I will answer all that can be, subject to NC law.
Ticket for the event are available at
285-2727
Yeah I'm about as crooked as every local person here. You guys would rather sentence someone before you get ALL the facts. Just remember when you point a finger you have 3 pointing right back at you. Try to help find the answers to the problems instead of pointing fingers and telling someone else to fix them. Or here's a novel idea move out of Mooresville I promise we wouldn't miss all the complaining. As far as Crone goes it looks like he's getting his. Too bad he was asked to be an accountant along with policing this "corupt" town. Who knows maybe they will find that he was taking thousands of dollars for pesonal use but I think all they will find is some poor accounting and bad judgement. So whats that get you , fired as it should.
How much will the TOM pay for the investigations to try to make you guys happy? Oh wait it still doesn't make you happy because the facts aren't the rumors you heard.
I am one of the people Rader calls an "Investigatton" and I'm proud of it! Eat your heart out Rader. The "Investigattons" are here to stay baby!
Sorry I won't be in town to question "Frankie Boy," but I bet he will hide behind personnel, or just pack up his toys and go home. I encourage all attending to wear bow ties; they elevate you above the fray and announce your pedigree to the world.
11:24, here's another "novel idea".
Why don't YOU "move out of Mooresville". I promise "we wouldn't miss" all your butt kissing of the local crooks. Why don't you put your name on your comment so that they can put you on some meaningless rubber stamp committee or another. Oh, that's right. You're probably already on one, or two, or three. My bad.
I am very concerned with the pace of these investigations. Thank you Ms. Gatton for keeping us apprised of any progress. It is particularly concerning that two months into this unfortunate situation we yet have to receive findings of an audit. In addition, it is puzzling to say the least that the inventory of the Police Department Evidence Room is being redone. The bottom line is that as of date we have received no findings whatsoever. That is indeed very troubling considering the gravity of this situation and all of its implications with regard to public confidence.
4 actually and I appreciate all your tax money.
Do we know if the IRS has been informed of the CFK funds and John Crone's failure to file and pay income taxes on those funds?
I Say let's kick all the Locals out and take over this town.
Amen to that!!!!!!
Really shouldn't this investigation be over with. Lets get on with cleaning house. Who's next?
I just read the 11:12 pm post. Is this for real or was it tongue in cheek? I don't get the Rader-at-large mailing.
it's for real word for word.
There is a new Town Manager on his way in. I'm sure he was hand picked. Someone that the Good Ole Boys can work into the system.
11:24 try to help find answers to the problems?????? I believe that is what Harold Salisbury repeatedly tried to do with regards to to the golf course. He went so far as to offer his time for free to work on the operation and budget. What type of help are you referring to? Why don't you tell everyone here on this blog what they can do to help???????? And after that, sign your name so they can call you and start helping.
Vote and then let your government work. Sign my name....HAHAHAHA... just like all you guys do.
Here's my favorite part of Rader's delusional soliloquy:
"The ground rules are:
Questioners/Investigattons identify themselves by name and town.
Questions are limited to one minute.
I will answer all that can be, subject to NC law."
Rader is setting "Ground Rules" prior to conversing with his constituency. As if that is not absurd enough on its face, he's also giving himself a backdoor exit strategy by selectively using "NC law". I doubt very seriously he consulted "NC laws" when he strutted into the Police Department and attempted to use his position as an elected official to sway prospective witnesses in favor of a corrupt police chief whom he already knew had transferred funds from the evidence room into his personal piggybank under the facade of Cops for Kids.
The only honorable thing at this point for Commissioner Rader to do is to resign his seat immediately. Anything short of that will continue to bring dishonor and shame to his office and therefore to our town.
12:03....Wait a minute...you said (at 11:24)...why don't we try to help find the answers to the problems.....what happened to that rant?????? You haven't answered how everyone can HELP find the answers to the problems......you are just as evasive as the elected officials. Or maybe you are one of them....
You could start by mowing my yard. And if you really want to help run for office and if you get voted in get to work.
Thanks, 11:12. So how many plan on attending this "forum" to see the song and dance?
Hey frankie Bowtie, I wouldn't get so cocky yet old boy. There's the little matter of witness tampering and your old buddy Crone must be in some pretty deep doodoo for the SBI to ask for a second inventory.
How many here for confiscating Crone's passport and limiting his travel to Iredell County. Hey I saw where Statesville is looking for a new police chief.Maybe they don't watch the news up there.
in response to Aug 22 @1146....has the IRS been called about taxes?I recall Crone saying in one of the News interviews that "He had paid taxes himself on the interest". To me, that alone shows that he used the money as if it were his.Another commment about the investigations still going on. That tells me that they don't like what they have found and need more time to figure out a game plan. They either want to make sure they are right in what they found or need more time to figure out how to cover up what they can and control the damage.
sole proprietorship Business Account = taxable income = reportable income = TAX OWED and NOT PAID YET for the past ten years = check Line 12 on John Crones tax returns for the last ten years. He said he paid interest on the money in the account, correct? Well why pay that and not the income tax owed on the rest of the profits? John Crone knew exactly what he was doing, yes?
I bet the IRS is involved and will be charging both John Crone and his wife with Tax Evasion. If they filed jointly and did not report the income from that business venture, then they are both guilty of that as well.
His tax bill is going to be huge, he was not a charity so can only deduct a small amount personally for charitiable contributions, no matter how much he spent on other people. The rest was income of a for profit business. Ya know John Gotti gave a lot too. But still went to prison.
Correct me if I am wrong someone, but wont it be like 35% of net profits. And since there were no products being sold (read really low overhead cost), it was virtually all profit.
I will guess his bill will be tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars for for the past ten years, plus all that other stuff the IRS like to tack on when someone does not pay their tax.
Those of you who plan to attend the Rader Zoo should know he is unable to focus on anything but his own ideas, and will leave the meeting if he dislikes the direction of the conversaton.
I recommend you lock the door as soon as the proceedings begin.
Harold
I'm in "Penguin's TIME OUT", and have been feuding with his thick impenatrable brain for a couple of years. His only defense to his improper misleading numbers and facts is correcting my english. So in the future , as I did to get into TIME OUT, is to reply to him with almost every word mispelled, and give him more time for nonsense and less time to srew up our town. He's a blooming idiot with no pride, shame, or even trying to somewhat fix what he has terribly been the leader in messing up. People, join the TIME OUT CLUB,since all that Rader has left to offer is??????????????????????????????
Word on the street is that Rader is "throwing himself under the bus" (just a little) so that he can try and save his right hand man's job right now (that's Erskine Smith). If he can distract attention away from Smith until September 2, Smith will be home free and can begin "assisting" the new town manager, just like he "assisted" the last two town managers. And the rest will be sad history, folks. Here we go again, round and round.
When you find yourself faced with anything related to Frank Rader, there are several considerations you must keep in mind.
1. He truly believes the Sun and Solar System revolve around him!
2. He has invented "Rader Math" to compensate for his inability to do basic arithmetic!
3. His mind is in a parallel universe, which is occupied by beings born with substandard intelligence that deteriorates as they mature; and,
4. His basic philosophy is - "what is good for Frank Rader is good for the U.S.A"!
Harold Salisbury
Shame on you , 8/22 2008 11:46 and 11:48 pm. I'm originally from Rhode Island, and lived in a few other states, and trust me,local people are the core of any community. Speaking for myself,I think the native Mooresvillians (probably mispelled that RADER) are wonderful fine people. It's people like you that give us a bad name,and make it very difficult to get into local culture, because of their mistrust for out of towners. Cut the bull, and use your bashing energy, and get involved in more positive things in town.
Frank Rader can try anything he likes. He thinks we are all two-year-olds anyway. We know exactly who is ultimately responsible for the complete lack of oversight of former Police Chief John Crone. Smith has always been allowed to have authority without responsibility by his own immediate supervisors, former town managers Rick McLean and Jamie Justice. We know what happened to both of them. Now we will have to wait and see what Smith's current immediate supervisors, the town commissioners, do about this particularly bad penny.
14 months 12 days until next municipal elections.
Thanks Vic for your 11:59 A.M. comment. I'm one of the "locals", born and bred, and I've been fighting the corruption here for years now along with others. Ironically, it took a "non-local" to open my eyes to the problems here, so I'm mighty grateful for the folks who're making Mooresville their new home and bringing an outside perspective to things here. We got a ways to go, looks like, but it's definitely moving in the right direction. The Gatton Report is a tremendous resource for quickly exposing and hopefully purging those who are either abdicating their duties or corruptly abusing their position or powers.
Jaime, Jaime, Jaime! What do these guys think? That you're gonna go and forget all about checking up on their little investigations? Boy, they sure don't know you like I do! If they did, the investigations would have already been done and over with, to save themselves a bunch of headaches!
Girl, you keep burning it up. You've had almost 125,000 hits on this little hometown activist blog of yours and it hasn't even been 6 months yet. You're thankin' and spankin' this town clean. So proud of you. In the years to come, we're all gonna think about Mooresville as "pre-Report" and "post-Report".
You rock! And YOU, the guy they call BOWTIE RADER, I'm talking to you: You can call me an investiGATTON anyday, and I'll just call you "Sooooo Ten Minutes Ago".
Correction!!!!!!!!!
My 12:18 comment should have said.
"and stop your bashing energy" instead of use your bashing energy. Oh Geeeeeeeeeee gess I'm in TIME OUT again RDER:( :(
And thank you 12:18 pm for your postive comments.
12:18, I like what you said about "outside perspective". I think the problem for too long here has been that people like Rader and Smith whose forefathers were "somebody" in this town, think that they are Feudal Lords in a feudal system where our role is to "give" and their role is to "take". We must "give" our taxes, our respect, and our obedience unquestioningly, while they "take" those things and have to do nothing in return except patronize or ignore us. The dying old guard of Mooresville always needed sacred cows, and thanks to them and their brainwashed offspring, Rader and Smith have become our most recent sacred cows.
This is a continuation of the "Count Up Vigil" of the number of days which pass from the day Cops For Kids scandal broke (7/4/08) to the day that Police Chief Crone and Interim Town Manager Erskine Smith are both suspended, terminated or resign.
The Police Chief was suspended (with pay) on Tuesday, 7/8/08. He was terminated on 8/8/08. The community is clearly relieved and deeply grateful that Mr. Crone has vacated his post. However, serious questions continue to mount with regard to Mr. Smith's decision to continue paying Mr. Crone a salary for the intervening month.
Interim Town Manager Erskine Smith, Mr. Crone’s supervisor, remains in his position and continues to operate still. Therefore I shall continue this Vigil until he, too, vacates any post he holds as a public official in Mooresville due to his role in this matter as well as other matters that have been brought to light.
The town board has placed Finance Director Maia Setzer in charge of oversight of the CFK process (including but not limited to any audits and investigations) which indicates that they, too, lack confidence and trust in the Interim Town Manager. Despite this lack of confidence, Mr. Smith remains in his position, a position to which the Finance Director reports.
The information I specifically refer to is:
1) documented misrepresentations made by Mr. Smith with regard to the nonprofit corporation known as Cops For Kids
2) Mr. Smith's direct recommendation to the town board to include the nonprofit corporation known as Cops For Kids into the town's general budget in the amount of $20,000
3) Mr. Smith's failure to perform due diligence in his capacity as Interim Town Manager by properly researching Cops For Kids prior to submitting his recommendation to the town board
4) Mr. Smith's involvement in a questionable commission in the amount of $237,151.50 as outlined in the Gatton Report blog entry dated 4/18/08 and titled “Friends don’t let friends gouge Mooresville taxpayers”, the contents of which have never been publicly disputed by Mr. Smith
5) Mr. Smith’s failure or refusal to change Mr. Crone’s status to “unpaid” suspension despite the surfacing of various contradictory statements made by Mr. Crone in the media since his suspension
6) Mr. Smith’s failure or refusal to fire Mr. Crone despite his assumed knowledge of the damning evidence presented in a Gatton Report articles dated July 22, 2008
7) Mr. Smith’s failure or refusal to insure that a complete financial audit is conducted and released of Cops For Kids records, despite the mayor’s assurance that this process had begun on July 8, 2008
8) Mr. Smith’s use of double standards when enforcing employment policies, as evidenced by his statements in the August 2008 “Town Voice”
9) The fact that Mr. Smith staunchly resisted firing Mr. Crone until after there was citizen unrest which resulted in a citizens protest on the Mooresville Town Hall on 8/4/08. The protest in turn brought about significant negative publicity for the town. Mr. Smith’s inexplicable delay in firing Mr. Crone therefore ultimately resulted in tarnishing the town’s reputation
This is Day No. 50.
Did somebody say Sacred Cows? I think it's time for a great big Bar-B-Q.
Thanks to whomever posted the portion of the Rader-At-Large for me. I received an e-mail from Rader on 8/21 in which he provided me a "draft" of what he intended to put into his e-mail thingy. Oddly, there was no reference to Investigattons. Oddly, his e-mail to me said that "we" will not go into the meeting "preconditioned", but everything he has put out regarding this meeting is inherently preconditioned. Oh well, this should be interesting. I guess in all fairness I should respond to him and tell him that I will only answer questions which I can and want to, and are in line with NC law. At any rate, here's the e-mail to compare with the actual Raderblog:
Hi, Larry
I'm up late working on this. Want to get Rader at Large out Thurs
The Aug 27 meeting at the Library is on. There will probably be additional meetings, I think the Wed after ToM Commissioner meetings, but have not decided. Calendar is crowded.
I went to a portion of Rep McHenry's meeting tonight and got some ideas compared with his meeting last time. The major pick up is I'm coming in with a prepared presentation on budget. This will lead, and allow for late comers.
Thus the show goes on regardless of who attends. There are 26 addresses in the ToM Media list and they will be notified in a similar manner with the 1,800 in Rader at Large.
I will answer all questions I can and I want to. That is what Rader at Large and ToM Chats is about.
We will not go into the meeting preconditioned.
This will be two way. I have questions and would like to hear answers.
A curve ball is one potential questioner is in Time Out. He/She can reveal their status, but I will not unless they ask a question. It is not you. I doubt if this questioner comes.
Here is what Rader at Large says about Aug 27, except for some puns and jokes I always slip into Rader at Large for the alert. This is DRAFT.
On Wednesday, August 27 at the ToM Library at 7 - 9 pm I will have a “ToM Exchange”,
The exchange is of idea and opinion. The new event is born of statements and questions posed by a folk(s) who think I’ve done wrong and to “publish” as much ToM information as legally and practically possible.
Among the queries, this:
“Commissioner Rader took it upon himself to penetrate the sanctity of the police department and inject himself into this personnel/criminal investigation by overtly trying to influence the rank and file police officers.”
and among the questions, this:
“. . . would you find it appropriate for an elected official to attend and make presentations at several recent staff meetings of the police department and apparently share with officers the anonymous letter that was sent to Crone?”
Among anticipated questions this: (Rader wording) Why did you speak with ToM Police about the Cops for Kids investigation and what did you say?
This is part of speculation (my term) spoken, written and demonstrated by anonymous, though some public, voices. (Note: I do not read Web Logs = Blogs.)
The questioners prefer email questions and I prefer face to face, thus the evening, which, if well attended, will become monthly or quarterly.
I cannot assure the questioners will attend, though the prime reason for the session is to address their questions and ask them mine. An invitation to a specific questioner to attend a ToM Chat has been turned down by the questioner, insisting on email correspondence.
I’ll come with a prepared discussion of the ToM Budget (yawn) and lead with that, then field what question may come, subject to NC Statute restrictions (mainly personnel and closed session).
Note: One of the potential questioners is in Time Out for using language not acceptable in Kindergarten and will not be entertained. To the extent the questioner insists on questioning, it will just consume time.
The ground rules are:
Questioners identify themselves by name and town.
Questions are limited to one minute.
I will answer all that can be, subject to NC law.
Mr Green,since Rader does not read blogs,perhaps we could post any questions that people want answered and have different people at the meeting make sure all questions are asked in the one minute time limit. 15 questions by 15 different speakers.
I was reading the count-up vigil’s list again, and something hit me. It’s curious how a guy like Frank Rader puts his foot down on a regular Joe Blow citizen like Vic Marquis for a little “language”, but he happily puts up with Erskine Smith’s sleazy misconduct. What’s wrong with that picture?
I personally think we need to have another march/media event and demand Erskine either be removed or placed in a position that doesn't hold political pwoer. He's been with ToM 21 years, he can retire and seek other employment.
What do you guys think?
Posting questions may not be a bad idea, but I think the fact that Rader insists that he doesn't read "blogs" really indicates that he does read "blogs", or at least is fed information from others as to what's on the investigatton's minds.
I think there are a few things we need to do to put pressure on the commissioners to address the interim town manager issue instead of stalling until the new town manager arrives and letting him take all the heat:
1. We need to show up in large numbers on Wednesday night and not allow Rader to cop out (no pun intended) of answering questions.
2. We need to secure signatures on the recall petition to show that we're not going to tolerate corruption and unethical practices from our elected officials.
3. We need to bombard the commissioners with phone calls and e-mails letting them know that a failure on their part to remove the interim town manager will result in a negative result for them in the polls whenever they come up for next election.
4. We need to write official letters of complaint regarding the interim town manager for the gross mismanagement of this, and other events. Use the system which is in place to force their hands.
If, after all that, they continue to show a lack of regard for the will of the people, then we march and unite publicly once again right after the arrival of new town manager so that he clearly understands the depth of our disgust.
Sorry for the long post (which I believe some would say validates me being locked up in a mental institution), but wanted to share my thoughts and get some feedback from others who desire to see Mooresville be a town which is based on ethical practices in our government.
The fact that this particular town board has continued to employ Smith FIFTY days into this fiasco is all I need to know as far as whether the Big Four were for real or just a big sham. We can talk all we want about the RATS, but what's the other supposed four "Good Guys" excuse for tolerating a clearly corrupt Smith? Maybe they aren't tolerating him, but from where we all sit, it seems like they are. I'm getting the feeling that we've all been had, and not just by the RATS.
Hey everybody, since "Penguin" doesn't read blogs, i'm guessing other commisioners do????
That alone will keep them on their toes and hopefully not follow RADERS' lead any longer. That in itself will be a great acomplishment.
I am sure Radar reads this blog, he is too vain not to read it. I guess we could post questions that we are not going to ask, just to fool with him. When he refuses to answer a question, we could have the next person repeat the same question, and the next person repeat the same question, etc.
Could someone ask how long the "budget" presentation will last, since we know how much time our questions will be allowed I think we should know how long his presentation (which I am sure is to discourage people from attending) will take. I may accidently be that amount of time late for the meeting
Is Radar still driving a ToM car???
I do not think any of our ELECTED officials can think that he has a chance to continue in politics in our ToM
Vic, I can't resist. ;)
impenetrable
misspelled
English
screw
For those "investigattons" that are interested, you can contact Mr. Smith's Professional Association:
International City/County Management Association(ICMA)(icma.org) in Washington DC and tell them what a great job Mr. Smith has done. The ICMA Main # is 202-289-ICMA and ask for the Executive Director Robert "Bob" O'Neill Jr.(roneill@icma.org) or you can call the ICMA Ethics Center 202-962-3521 and pass on your "compliments." I would however suggest speaking with their General Counsel and asking if Mr. Smith's job performance is within their Code of Ethics. (Please go to the Code of Ethics tab and read it you haven't already(icma.org)-can you say "violation possabilities") They are very helpful with filing complaints information. Oh I almost forgot, be sure and tell them you read the Gatton Report-I think they should become "investigattons" as well, its good for the soul.
Good note that Rader's "meeting" with the people is just a smokescreen to deflect attention from his boy, Smith. Once Smith is gone, Rader will be totally neutered as he should be and this town should be on the right track with a new town manager.
I just read this comment in an older thread (Friends don't let Friends Gouge the Taxpayer). Cut & pasted it below. Made me sick to my stomach. This has been the No. 2 man in Town Hall for over a decade. Great reflection on the town.
COMMENT:
During a local citizen's investigation of the golf course, Assistant Town Manager Erskine Smith wrote this to the Golf Course Director, who worked under him: "I am debating in my mind about the financial information. I’m not sure I want to give the info. I want to give him a “little”, make him “work” a lot. However, I don’t really care it is all public anyway I just want to “flush” him out in the open.” Smith was referring to a public record request made by the citizen who had discovered financial irregularities as well as missing inventory in the Pro Shop. An SBI investigation was subsequently launched, the results of which have never been released.
It appears there may be a serious escalation of unrest,from a variety of sources,in Mooresville.
1. Erskine Smith continues to be employed.
2.Frank Rader is not in JAIL,and continues to mock the residents.
3.Mayor Thunberg remains hidden,arrogant and uninterested in the welfare of the Town and residents.
4.The Board of Commissioners fails to react or take steps to correct the developing disaster.
5.The Merchants sit back with their fingers crossed,paralyzed and reluctant to put pressure on the Town Officials.
6.Taxes are increasing,Services are decreasing,and a fortune is spent on Consultants!
The MARCH/DEMONSTRATION successfully made a Statement.However,only one problem was resolved!
If additional action is genuinely wanted,the program needs to add pressure.
Look into a widespread BOYCOTT!
This can begin with Thunberg's retail store!
If the Town merchants do not agree to lend their voices,through their Association,and demand immediate change,they need to be advised they will be boycotted!
Randy Marion,reportedly,
threatened the Tribune with the discontinuation of his advertising,if they continued to publish articles that were critical of the current Town administration.HE NEEDS TO BE COUNSELLED!
A Boycott of the Tribune(cancellation of subscriptions etc.)should begin,and continue until they agree to publish all articles,pro & con relative to the Town Officials and Administration,providing they are within the bounds of propriety!
It might also be appropriate to withhold early payment of property taxes.
Until people see and realize the indifference and arrogance will affect them,they have a natural aversion to become involved. A Boycott will encourage them to reconsider!
Thanks to whoever informed us of the ICMA website. I have noticed that Erskine Smith had begun in the past year to place those initials after his name, but I did not know what they represented. After visiting ICMA.ORG and studying the list of ethical tenets, I was astounded by the number of those tenets which have been outright trampled by the Assistant Town Manager of Mooresville. Just for starters, below is Tenet #3.
Tenet 3
Be dedicated to the highest ideals of honor and integrity in all public and personal relationships in order that the member may merit the respect and confidence of the elected officials, of other officials and employees, and of the public.
Erskine Smith "dedicated to the highest ideals of honor and integrity"??? Can we all pick up our jaws off our chests now? Are you telling me that Erskine Smith is purporting to have such ethics or that he is SUPPOSED to have such ethics? Is he misrepresenting himself (you know, kinda like Crone did?) Are his bosses aware of this ICMA thing? If so, why haven't they been jumping up and down about this?
Does anybody know if Smith is entrusted with a town-issued credit card? And if so, what financial controls are in place to insure he has not abused that card?
Controls? Did some really ask about controls? Aye Aye Aye
Yep. Same "controls" that people like Erskine used with John Crone and CFK and golf course, etc.
How much ya'll wanna bet Erskine's been living it high on the hog on his town credit card?
I think all readers should call ICMA tomorrow AM and tell them what the hell is going on in this town. Maybe if the Town Commissioners won't reign in this "loose screw," maybe he can have a sit down and answer some questions with the ICMA. If the commissioners keep him, he should at least have the fact that he was investigated by the ICMA as an accolade on his resume/reputation.
Here's the 9th tenet of the ICMA folks:
"Keep the community informed on local government affairs; encourage communication between the citizens and all local government officers; emphasize friendly and courteous service to the public; and seek to improve the quality and image of public service."
Sound like something Erskine Smith is doing, or has ever done, for that matter? I see they're giving away "ICMA Credentials" these days to just anybody.
Harold you crack me up. So now you are basically trying install fear in merchants to get them to support your views. Sounds a bit like black-mail!
"Randy Marion,reportedly,
threatened the Tribune with the discontinuation of his advertising,if they continued to publish articles that were critical of the current Town administration. HE NEEDS TO BE COUNSELLED!"
Key word there Harold is reportedly. Did you hear this with your own ears? Probably one of the many rumors you hear but the problem is you take it as gospel. There are some arguments you have that are quiet logical but this in mind is a misplaced threat. If I were Randy I would probably be consulting a lawyer about a slander lawsuit.
The town merchants seem to be in enough of a bind with construction and a retreating economy but if you want to take money out of their pockets and stuff into corperate Americas then enjoy your shopping at Wal-mart and the rest of the gang.
I have lost all respet for you. I guess your true colors are showing. Your nothing more than a spoiled child and if people don't see things the same way you do then lets just beat them while they are down until they do. Thanks for clearing the view! Please excuse me if I bit your arm off while your trying to shove it down my throat.
Oh yeah, can you tell me why you would ever pay your property taxes early if they cost the same in January?
10:18 (a/k/a Chriso, did I get that right?) We wondered where you disappeared to. For people like you Harold Salisbury may be an easy target, but the rest of us out here can see right through you. Your post is an insult to the intelligence of anyone who reads it.
BTW, "slander" only applies to that which is untrue, so you may want to go check your facts before you start throwing that word around in an attempt to intimidate and silence a private citizen.
I, for one, agree with Mr. Salisbury wholeheartedly that the time has come for more serious civil disobedience in this town.
I tried in vain to get people out to vote. Nothing will change until more than 2500 taxpaying citizens get out and vote. Speaking of that would someone tell me who put one of my campaign signs at the end of Timber and Shears with "Little Bear" over my name?
Timing is everything Larry. It's pretty obvious that if Thunberg was up this November you'd take him easily. My question is will the voting public remember in 14 months?
Timing is everything Larry. It's pretty obvious that if Thunberg was up this November you'd take him easily. My question is will the voting public remember in 14 months?
2 days left till King Frank holds court. I can't wait.
12:36 Chriso I am not. Harold used the word reportedly in connection to his statement so I don't know what else to call it but slander. It just seems his statements are aimed at the wrong people. I thought it was the politics in this town you guys were trying to clean up and I think a boycott of local merchants who have nothing to do with the decision making is out of line. You should know Harold isn't a man that can be intimidated and thats not my intention. Although I must say his statements could easily be mistaken for intimidation, strong arming, black-mailing... for what, because some of the merchants don't see eye to eye or want to be involved. Does Harold really think they all love Thunburg and support him. Thunburg didn't stand by the Downtown funding which I sure doesn't give alot of the merchants a warm fuzzy feeling about Mr. Thunburg. BTW if Harold's statements had come from a politician in this town you guys would be burning them at the stake and rightfully so. I can hear it now If Smith and the gang asked people to boycott local merchants until the merchants applied pressure to get everyone in the same boat. Isn't that the same difference. Sorry in advance for insulting your intelligence once again.
Reply to 10:18
I read with great interest your critique relative to my suggestion for increased action that may stimulate changes in Mooresvile. You said you had lost respect for me, and I don't know if that bothers me, since I don't know who you are.
However, you are obviously happy, hiding behind the screen of anonymity, and expressing your thoughts.
I am certain more than 100 Mooresvillians have participated in the very popular Blog, and you appear to be one of them. The sad reality is that, while the opportunity for self-expression is provided, the majority of participants express their opinions, complain, and criticize the situations that affect them, and take no individual action to make a change. It took the time, effort, and some personal expense for one Blogger to organize the March/Demonstration. I don't know if you participated, but if you did, you had to feel a measure of accomplishment, and pride.
Although only one change occurred, something DID happen.
The Drones and Officials want you to keep writing! They know if you keep doing this, there is little chance they will have to deal with any of the problems.
My suggestion was intended to provide an opportunity to increase pressure where it was needed, and to do so by including the merchants, through their Association, since they will be beneficiaries of the results.
Either a change is needed or it is not. I can assure you the decision-makers believe they do not have to react to rhetoric, since there is no indication their cocoon is in danger. They are comfortable living in the shadow of anonymity since they know you will do nothing.,
Whoever you are, the weight of your opinions will increase when you step-up to the plate.
Cordially,
Harold Salisbury
Harold said "If the Town merchants do not agree to lend their voices,through their Association,and demand immediate change,they need to be advised they will be boycotted!"
"My suggestion was intended to provide an opportunity to increase pressure where it was needed, and to do so by including the merchants, through their Association, since they will be beneficiaries of the results."
So the latter is your political spin I guess. To me I still hear you saying you know what is best for all and if we must hurt your pockets to make you agree with us then we will. But oh yeah if you are still in business when we get our way, you the merchants,will benifit. I am for open government but I will not participate in forcing hard working citizens into a hardship over my poltical views. Just my anonymous opinion.
How about Ethics Tenet No. 12 of the "ICMA" that Erskine so proudly puts after his name:
Tenet 12
Seek no favor; believe that personal aggrandizement or profit secured by confidential information or by misuse of public time is dishonest.
Harold, you've clearly hit a raw nerve with somebody. Good for you! It wasn't too long ago that there were indeed elected officials calling for various boycotts of local activists' businesses and the local newspaper who were exposing corruption, and I doubt seriously this person ("Chriso" or whatever they call themselves) piped up on their behalf. What's good for the goose is good for the gander!
5:14, I only have 4 words for you and others like you:
No Justice No Peace
i am not 10:18.
Sure you aren't...Whatever you say.
I was one of those merchants that were boycotted back in 2003 and 2004 by the powers that be because I dared to speak out publicly about the ramped corruption in our town government. Thank God that I was able to stay in business and recover. I knew about the Randy Marion incident with the tribune. There were elected officials, Town employees, and there friends walking around telling blatant lies about me and other business owners to there friends and anyone who would listen because we dared to speak out against the corruption. Most of those that were doing the slandering back then are now out of power. Thank God for Jaime and her Blog. Those days are over. Harold and Kay are heroes to me. I respect anyone that has the backbone to speak the truth.
What business did you run?
Here is the ICMA's definition of "Gifts" which ethically officials such as Smith should not accept:
Gifts. Members should not directly or indirectly solicit any gift or accept or receive any gift--whether it be money, services, loan, travel, entertainment, hospitality, promise, or any other form--under the following circumstances: (1) it could be reasonably inferred or expected that the gift was intended to influence them in the performance of their official duties; or (2) the gift was intended to serve as a reward for any official action on their part.
2:59 PM - Who wants to know?
August 26, 2008 9:59 AM: I'm not a hundred percent sure who you are but you're on a short list of people since in the time frame you're talking about there wasn't but a handful of you standing up and shouting that this town was in trouble. Now we all know for sure it's in trouble and has been for some time so the list of local troublemakers has grown and thankfully so. If you're any one of the several I'm thinking, want you to know that I and many others actually started doing business with you BECAUSE we knew what lay in the black hearts of the handful of people who were trying to hush you up. You're right. They're mostly gone now but not before they spawned themselves into a couple still sitting up there. Keep the faith and keep up the fight, cause the silent majority in this town's got your back as you can see by the kind of business you're doing.
I would love to know which business you operate, but appreciate your position if you choose not to. If you would care to e-mail me (admin@cfrgm.org) I'm fairly certain my family will use your business services.
Come on, "Frank"! "Put in a mental hospital for three days without a reason"? Come on, now! You remember the reason! Think backkkkkkkkkk............
Hey "Day Counter", did you know that the town probably didnt' pay the 237K commission you're sooo mad about. I believe that a seller pays the commission on those kinds of things. I could be wrong. Why not look into that?
This is Day 1.
Nice try, 10:13, but here's a little something for you to chew on. The "Day Counter" is more right than he knows.
For your reading enjoyment, courtesy Gatton Report:
Friday, April 18, 2008
"Friends don't let friends gouge Mooresville taxpayers"
Just like the rest of us, town officials have friends. It's just that some friends come at a higher cost than others.
And at least twice in the past four years, Mooresville taxpayers have foot the hefty bill for certain town officials throwing business to their friends.
Most recently, Jimmy McKnight – owner of Realco Investment Properties, Inc. and a lifelong friend of Interim Town Manager Erskine Smith’s – pocketed a $237,151.50 commission check, courtesy of Mooresville taxpayers, for doing practically nothing.
Yes ... no reason other than unsubstantiated rumors. Rumors, oh informed one, that resurfaced last year and which a certain assistant principal attempted to help grow. Imagine that, a person locked up for no reason at all other than rumors. That doesn't happen in the US, now, does it? Maybe the same standard should have been applied to the CFK situation.
As for the commission check, it's not necessarily true that the seller pays the commission. If the agent was acting as a buyer's agent, there is a possibility that the town paid the commission.
The town absolutely paid that commission. I know because I saw the check and I won't ever forget it.
10:13 is that you Koolaid lady? Where you been? Coming back for more? Now you're picking on "Frank" and "Day Counter"? Come pick on somebody your own size.
Tell me again why Erskine Smith is still warming a seat up at Town Hall? What? Oh, yeah, how silly of me. So that he can do his usual dirty underhanded illegal stuff to make darn sure Rader and Thunberg get reelected despite all odds. It's all starting to make sense to me now. Fear is the great motivator of shady politicians.
10:28 Larry. There are always 2 sides to every story. Did you only hear one? Did you talk to any doing the accusing? I did!
I did read all available documents, including the written statements of the accusors, Franks's school files, and all available police documents. There was nothing which rose to the levels required by the law. There was no documentation of a complaint lodged with the police department, and the school documents specifically stated that Frank posed no threat to himself or to others (both of which are required to obtain an involuntary commitment). The SRO did not conduct an investigation into the allegations. Were there inapporpriate comments? yes. Do inappropriate comments warrant an involuntary commitment? no.
So what course of action would you have taken? How would you feel if your child had been on the other end of the phone? What if these preventitive measurse would have been taken in other school tragedies? Would you have held the school or police liable if something would have happened knowing the information they had? Just some questions to ponder.
First, there was no documentation of a phone call involved in this situation. If there was a phone call, that should have been documented by the police.
What would I have done?
Contact the other parent(s) involved to discuss the situation and to make them aware.
Contact law enforcement if I deemed there to be a credible threat.
Contact the school to advise them of the previous actions, and, if necessary, file a complaint with them.
Seek a restraining order based on the perceived threat.
The police department, in this instance, did not do their job by conducting an investigation. The SRO's information,as presented to the magistrate, was a repeat of what the school's threat assessment included. Mind you, the school denies any involvement in the involuntary commitment although their employee was present in the police car when Frank was taken into custody.
I'm not saying that Frank didn't say things which could have alarmed some people. I'm suggesting that, when taken in context, and viewed in its entirety was not anything close to the legal standard for such a drastic action.
Frank was suspended for two days at the conclusion of the school year in question, which I think was probably a wise decision. I think the family would have been fine with that and perceived that the suspension was the punishment most appropriate for this situation.
I guess part of my point, though I'm probably not saying it too well, is that the school system and the police department had no systems in place to deal with this situation. They had no threat assessment procedure or threat assessment team trained on how to do a threat assessment. The team chose to download a threat assessmet from the internet, without board approval and without training, and then did not follow all the steps outlined within that particular downloaded tool. The conclusion of the threat assessment team was that Frank's actions, taken in context,did not suggest him to be pose an immediate threat to himself or to anyone else, and actually wanted to immediately begin working with Frank on some behavior modications and social skills training because his comments and actions of concern were directly related to his neurological disorder.
The school sat on the initial complaint rceived for almost 2 months -- which indicates they viewed it as a non-emergency.
The only good part out of all of this is that due to Frank's situation and the pushing of others in the community, the schools now have a tool which is useable by trained staff members, is in accordance with national standards, and seeks to respond in a timely manner to any allegations.
Again, should Frank have been suspended? yes, which he was. Should he have been committed involuntarily? No, not based on anything I've read or was presented to teh magistrate.
I'm sure I didn't answer all your questions, and appreciate the discourse, which goes both ways.
If someone started a rumor that your child was going to blow up the school, what would you want to have happen?
Hey 8/27 10:50 - You "actually saw the check" that McKnight received? That check should have been issued from a closing attny? Pray tell how you saw it?
Also, I think you are making an assumption, Larry. Yes, buyers can pay commissions if that is what is agreed but is that what occured?
Why knock McKnight?
"I'm not saying that Frank didn't say things which could have alarmed some people."
Do you have kids in school, Larry? If some kid makes "alarming remarks" that resemble what Frank said - sorry "allegedly" said, at a minimum I'd want his head examined, too!
"I'm not saying that Frank didn't say things which could have alarmed some people. I'm suggesting that, when taken in context, and viewed in its entirety was not anything close to the legal standard for such a drastic action."
Judge & jury.
Ever consider that sometimes officials don't have the luxury to wait and see what might happen.
You'd be condemming those same officials had "Frank" of any other student carried out such threats.
I suppose had Harris & Klebold had "behavioral modification" and "social skills training" in time then Columbine may not have happened.
I'd rather have had some possible "over reaction" here than a body count.
This is what I said:
"As for the commission check, it's not necessarily true that the seller pays the commission. If the agent was acting as a buyer's agent, there is a possibility that the town paid the commission."
Key word there for you is possibility. I'm not knocking McKnight.
"Do you have kids in school, Larry? If some kid makes "alarming remarks" that resemble what Frank said - sorry "allegedly" said, at a minimum I'd want his head examined, too!"
Yes, I have 3 in school in the MGSD school system -- at three different schools.
"If some kid makes "alarming remarks" that resemble what Frank said - sorry "allegedly" said, at a minimum I'd want his head examined, too!"
The first word shows your position. Did you actually hear Frank make these alleged remarks? Pray tell how you would know what Frank said or didn't say, or what allegations were or were not documented? The only way you could know is if you are/were a school employee involved in the situation, or a police officer involved in the situation -- especially since you are aware of the "behavior modifications" and the "social skills training".
Judge and Jury -- no, just someone who can read Chapter 122C of the general statutes.
"Ever consider that sometimes officials don't have the luxury to wait and see what might happen."
Yes, but given the fact that the "alleged" comments took place over two months prior to any police activity, I think it was readily apparent that nothing did happen or was going to happen.
"I suppose had Harris & Klebold had "behavioral modification" and "social skills training" in time then Columbine may not have happened."
I would suggest you study the history of these two individuals before you begin using them as the standard. Interestingly, following Columbine a threat assessment was developed for schools to implement in order to gauge a student's potential lethality. Columbine took place in 1999, and you mean to tell me that neither the MGSD nor the MPD bothered to put into place the recommended protocol? Had the protocol been in place, we would not be having this discussion. Had the SRO done an investigation, we would not be having this conversation.
"You'd be condemming those same officials had "Frank" of any other student carried out such threats."
Another assumption on your part, and quite untrue. The condemnation arises because there was no investigation, the SRO misrepresented the facts, the school system lied about their involvement, and Frank was violated based entirely upon rumors.
I hope that you never have a family member who is subjected to the events Frank experienced. Again, I've read all available documents. If you have evidence supporting your viewpoints I'd be happy to review those.
Chriso, you are fighting a lost battle about the McKnight commission Erskine Smith handed over to his buddy from preschool time on. Somebody already told you all this, but you're obviously gonna pretend you didn't read it, so here it is again, right out of this thread. Which part can't you understand? Perhaps we can walk you through it. It's all on public record and confirmed by the commissioners themselves. Anyhow, it's a good chance to keep reminding everybody about what happened, so thanks. Give up the ghost man. Erskine's as good as gone. Go find yourself another "friend" in Town Hall to mooch off of.
Friday, April 18, 2008
"Friends don't let friends gouge Mooresville taxpayers"
Just like the rest of us, town officials have friends. It's just that some friends come at a higher cost than others.
And at least twice in the past four years, Mooresville taxpayers have foot the hefty bill for certain town officials throwing business to their friends.
Most recently, Jimmy McKnight – owner of Realco Investment Properties, Inc. and a lifelong friend of Interim Town Manager Erskine Smith’s – pocketed a $237,151.50 commission check, courtesy of Mooresville taxpayers, for doing practically nothing.
FIRE ERSKINE SMITH. Every day that he collects a paycheck on our dime is one more day that these so-called elected officials are going to have to explain to us, the people who are actually paying this corrupt loser's salary.
Mr. Salisbury,
Not all of us are securely retired, therefore we cannot come out from under the cloak of annonymity. I for one would appreciate it if we could all work together in whatever capacity we feel safe. I appreciate your articulate and sometimes hilarious comments, and the pressure you're applying to "hold their toes to the fire". I just don't feel safe yet(I'm not 10:18). Maybe one day we can express our opinions without fear of retaliation here in the great United States and most importantly in Mooresville,NC. I read a post on the latest thread from someone in another community inspired by this movement. We ARE making a difference. Let's not be antagonists towards one another.
i am one of the people who can't afford to speak out even tho i'm fed up with what i see. i seen quality hardworking blue collar town workers get fired over nothing while a fat cat like Erskine Smith that nobody respects gets away with letting something like the police chief thing blow up. i was across the street sitting in my car when the protesters marched down the street. i know other people know what i know. maybe we can't march with you or write letters with our names but we help in whatever ways we can believe me.
There are a few people at MGSD and
Lake Norman that are known to have
committed a felony.These people are still working in their posh jobs.Why dosn't the person that this happened to come forward and let everyone know what MGSD did to her.It's not right that they get away with this.
The tax payers have a right to know
how their tax dollars are spent.
So do you know who paid the commission to McKnight, Larry?
Whether is was McKnight or Joe Schmoe, a commission would have been paid.
One thing is for sure; "Before hours" and "After hours" MUST END NOW!! No more "networking". No more chance of "shadey deals". No more chances that "someone might someone that knows someone that grew up with someone that knew someone's brother and went to kindagarden together and might have an advantage of knowing someone and might........." Pick your favorite scenario. Probably a good idea to keep anyone who has lived in Mooresville for at least 5years from having anything to do with the schools, pd, town board etc. Sound good, Larry?
------------------------
What did "Frank" actually say that caused him to be treated so unfairly? His is the only word?
Have you just taken "Frank's" word about was or was not said?
Just so you will recall, you were the one that mentioned "behavioral modification" and "social training" in your post. You were being quoted.
As far as "another assumption", I believe that previous poster was quite right in that regard. You claim to be such a staunch advocate of "getting at the truth" that I believe you are blind to the possiblity that YOU could be wrong in your judgement!
You've already accused the SRO of "misrepresenting the facts" and the school officials of "lying". Spell it out. Demand the SRO be teminated. Name names of the school officials. You have no problem chunking anyone else out in traffic.
You don't see things this way, i know. You have a vandetta, Larry. I know you will say, "Yes, to get at the truth and hold those responsible accountable." I no longer believe it. I believe that it is ALL about "your truth". I, too, believe in truth.
I'd also be happy to "review" all the "evidence" that you have stockpiled. You've "read all available" documents etc, so again, name names and dates and demand justice.
Exited about your next book explaining how this writer and everyone else are (always)wrong....
Ummm, I'm not the one with an issue with McKnight's commission. I simply said that it's not necessarily true that a seller always pays the commission.
As for the other stuff, maybe I should take a page from Rader -- "believe what you will" and you must have done well at inference 101.
You're welcome to go and obtain the required permissions to obtain all those documents so that you can be truly informed. That would require, however, that you step out of the anonymous world.
I've already answered these questions multiple times in multiple venues and have offered to sit down with anyone at any time to discuss this.
I don't throw people under the bus, I simply state my opinion which is based on all available documents. I've not asked you to believe anything I've said, but have encouraged people to go and get the facts for themselves.
Now, I'm putting back on my tinfoil hat and going to drink some yummy koolaid so that I might fit in better to society at large.
"Yeah, and if it wasn't for those meddling kids, we'd of gotten away with it too!"
I don't seem to be able to hear the choir singing.
What gives, groupies?
For all of you who seem to be talking about "crooks" you are the crooks. Number one being the famous "doesn't know what she's talking about, big mouth" JAMIE! It's a shame you have nothing better to do than start a bunch of gossip columns. I pray that the lord has mercy on your soul because you are going to need it. What do any of you know about the Cops for Kids program or the trips that he took local high school children on to further their knowledge about the world around them? What do know about any of the good things that have happened…nothing because you refuse to focus on excellence. You would rather sit around and spend your time creating rubbish. And furthermore, if you're getting your information from this so called column or "JAMIE" I can be 99.9% certain it is incorrect or has loopholes. Let’s focus on a real fact for a second…Jamie Gatton was a former employee of the Mooresville Tribune. What happened? Oh, I know..she couldn’t print the whole truth then either. Honestly the way you people obsess over somebody else’s business is weak. If you don't like the way things are done, move on, or do something productive about it besides gossip. Even more shameful is the same group of incompetent people always stirring stuff up in this town. Maybe if you focused on your own faults instead of somebody else’s you could actually be a town leader...but what are you? No! And let me remind you why…you have no value, your insignificant and hollow. You lack the kind of characteristics that a town leader possesses. As for Chief Crone, he is a good man who has done lots of great things for this town. If you do not know him, how can you judge him? If we all went on what somebody else had to say, where would that leave us? Heck, he hasn't even been given the chance to plead his case. I am not saying he is guilty or not guilty, but what I am saying is he deserves a fair trial. However, he's been robbed of that because a select ineffectual group of inhabitants continue their scandal…which is exactly what it is. A SCANDAL…not a town scandal, a scandal of unconfirmed information from the Gatton terrorists. Why don’t you people bottle up all this negative energy and do something positive for a change. Even better, pull out the Bible and teach yourself something. If I didn’t know better I would think you were a bunch of high school adolescents. I’m done here, you are not worthy of any more of my time! Just remember one last thing…what goes around comes around tenfold. “Let he who is without sin cast the first stone!” “Judge ye not that you be judged”
If I understand the definition of gossip to mean idle talk or rumor, esp. about the personal or private affairs of others, then what Jamie does is far from gossip. In fact, each of her stories has been based on evidence and factual data, which you are more than welcome to go and review for yourself at town hall. That would mean you'd have to come out of your anonymous shell long enough to come into the light of truth. The truth, my friend, which was the cause for his termination from his position. His actions cause his termination. He is responsible for the activities surrounding CFK, not any of us whom you believe to be terrorists.
Secondly, What do any of you know about the Cops for Kids program or the trips that he took local high school children on to further their knowledge about the world around them? -- please tell me you're kidding. What was the purpose of the CFK as advertised on the town website. I'll tell you: feed the hungry, provide immediate help with heating bills, assistance with emergency housing for battered women; christmas gifts for needy children and elderly. Of all the money collected for the CFK, how much was actually spent on the purposes publicized by the town? Any guess? I know the answer. Trips for our students are nice, but it was not in line with the purposes of CFK.
Sounds to me like you are blinded to the reality of this particular situation by your relationship with Mr. Crone. It is difficult to think that someone we know could have done something like this. But he did. We don't need to know him personally in order to follow the money trail and arrive at a decision that CFK was grounds for his termination from his position. Whether or not he is legally culpable is for a court of law to decide.
Take out your own Bible and see that leaders are held to a higher standard than "regular folk". Rea your Bible and come to understand the depth of guilt and sin involved in activities of this particular thread of discussion. Take out your Bible to the many condemnations God makes upon people who abuse their power, misuse their position, and gain from their status. Seems to me that the Bible would require is to turn over the tables and to demand equality and justice. But if you're the sort who only wants to talk about forgiveness, then the entire discussion of sin is lost on you.
Mr. Green...well as many have stated, unfortunately we don't all have the luxury of coming out of the anonymous shell! As a man of the highest God, I find it hard to believe you are even spending your time following columns such as these. The ONLY reason I have been involved in such is to defend people who cannot defend themselves. Seems to me you are blinded by relationships with others! I have NEVER seen a "preacher/pastor" engaged in this sort of activity, nor try to organize rallies or marches against others. Because you are a preacher, shouldn’t you know it is up to God to determine the fate of others! Not up to his children to speed the process along!
Seems to me that the Good Rev is in pretty high company with the rebel preachers participating in these activities: Martin Luther, John Calvin, Mother Theresa, Martin Luther King, Jr., Bishop Tutu ..... and lest we forget, seems to me that the good saduccees such as yourself said the same about Jesus, the disciples, and the other rebel rousers.
Maybe you should be asking yourself why you're not involved in such things. I, for one, am thankful that Rev. Green and the other pastors are involved. I wish more had the balls to do the same.
To the Corruption Fighters and Justice Seekers of Mooresville:
"If you hear the dogs, keep going.
If you see the torches in the woods, keep going.
If they're shouting after you, keep going.
Don't ever stop. Keep going.
If you want a taste of freedom, keep going..."
Night Owl
Post a Comment